Self-Harm, Shame, and Healing

This week we take on a tough topic from one of our listeners, Self-Harm.  Such a vulnerable topic and one that is rarely covered with the transparency it deserves.  Tune in and share your thoughts at info@quietchaoskw.com or on Instagram @quietchaoskw.

Transcript

Intro: 0:01

Globally, one in every eight people suffer from a mental disorder, anxiety and depression affect people from all walks of life. All ages, all ethnicities, and we're here to talk about it. This is a quiet chaos podcast, from anxiety to depression, from disorders to marriage, and everything in between we're talking about we're talking about it. Oh, really raw, and we'll have some fun. Let's do it. This is the quiet chaos podcast. And now your host, author, therapist, international speaker, Jason and our solo women.

Jason Sullivan: 0:52

Welcome to the quiet chaos podcast. This is your host, Jason Sullivan. And welcome back to another exciting week. I hope you guys had a wonderful Halloween and hopefully you didn't get into too much trouble. That's the it's a fun time of the year. It's really kind of the beginning of the holidays, no. Halloween, and then Thanksgiving and Christmas and New Year. And it's a lot of breaks a lot of good times. And I hope you are all enjoying it to its fullest. This week, we have an amazing question. It's a very heartfelt and honest and transparent question. This is from Amelia Cortez in Miami, Florida. Amelia, I am excited to hear from you. You are not too far from my hometown of Orlando. So we're kind of neighbors. I think I spent a lot of time down there. And it's a beautiful place. And so I wanted to read Emily's words. And just to give you a sense of how transparent she is, and how open she's willing to be with me with you guys. And it's amazing. So, Amelia, here are your words, dear Jason, I cut pretty regularly. I use everything from blades to toothpicks. I don't know why I do it. I think it makes me feel calmer. But I feel like a total freak when I see my brother and sisters. They are so normal. And I'm the one that doesn't fit. I really wish that I had never been born. What's wrong with me? And how do I quit hurting myself? Amelia? That is a man, that is an amazing question. And I will do my best to give you an answer that that even comes close to honoring your transparency. And so with that, let's dive in and get started. The idea of self harm, you know, we tend to look at, in general, I think that the general public really doesn't know what to do with the topic. For a lot of people that doesn't make sense for for many it looks extreme. And and so what I want to do first is I want to clarify why it's really not as extreme as people think everybody does it to some degree. Simple, simple examples. When you're nervous sometimes. And let's say you have a scab and you're picking at it and picking picking, sometimes it really just kind of gives you a sense of relief, it feels like you can control something. And it has a calming effect. And so you'll see people that will pick up their scabs, sometimes going to the gym too much. There are people that go seven days a week and go for crazy long hours, maybe you're getting 20,000 steps in a day instead of eight to 10,000. These are all forms of self harm, that these are things that have a negative impact on the body that we use as coping strategies to regain some sense of control, some sense of pattern and some sense of groundedness. And as we go forward, that's really going to that's going to play a pretty big bearing in our discussion. And so I want to give you a few other examples. Cutting of course, is probably the main form of self harm that we see burning, pinching or hitting. So sometimes we pinch ourselves sometimes you'll see people hit themselves pretty hard. Sometimes people will poison themselves and maybe not to to life threatening ends but but there are people that will take pretty pretty heavy doses of medications like Tylenol, paracetamol, these kinds of things. Of course, some people will use drugs pretty to pretty high extremes. very much, though I think that people will know their limits with it. And, and so they tend to push those limits, starving and binging, we tend to think of these as impulses or control issues. But it's a very common thing. And so we're looking at not just one sense of self harm, but what we're looking at is a very open and very wide understanding of the term. And that kind of brings you into the idea that we really all struggle with some form of self harm. Another more common example, I think, would be overworking. If you're spending 5060 hours a week and a 40 hour job, you have to really ask yourself, What's What's the benefit? What harm does it bring to me? Does it? Does it come at a very high expense? Does it meet the need? That my career probably should? Or is it exhausting me, and really slowly tearing me down? Okay, so, so this is, like I said, this is a pretty wide ranging topic. It is not too far out there. And so Amelia, this will give us some context, all of the listeners, this will also give you guys some context as well. Now, the purpose why why do we do these things? I mean, it seems pretty counterintuitive. I mean, I don't think anybody wakes up in the morning planning out. Well, how am I going to sabotage myself today? How am I going to really just bring harm to my to myself? And I think what I find is that we tend to have trouble expressing what's really going on under the surface. When you look back at Carl Jung, Carl Jung separated things out, we have this mask that we wear on the outside, and we have the shadow on the inside the mask is what really keeps us socially presentable. It's what we want the world to see. And it comes at the cost of pushing down that darker part of ourselves the one that Jung would call the shadow. And the assumption that we take away is that the shadow is bad. It's the thing that we don't want the world to see around us. And I would really challenge that, that presupposition, and I think I think that Jung probably would as well, the the, the shadow is not a good or bad part of us. It's just a riskier part of us. It's a part of us that pushes boundaries, it's a part of us that it dreams, it's excited, it's passionate. But it's not always the most balanced part of us. And so we default back to the mask. And we think the mask is balanced. And we think that the mask is this healthy thing, but the mask apart from the shadow. In other words, the part of me that I want the world to see absent of the part of me that I hide from the world. It is just as unhealthy when it's disconnected. And so what you're seeing is that existential moment where one seems to outweigh the other, or I can't control that part of me that's inside that feels dark, that feels rage, it feels hurt, it feels pain. And so there's this attempt to try to rein it in. It also gives us a sense of control. That gives us a sense of really, in some ways, it reduces pain, which is a strange thought. But when you go to the gym, for example, people leave the gym and they say man that hurt I felt the burn it. It was a good heart. I don't get that I go to the gym, and I just hurt maybe it maybe because I'm getting old. Sometimes I get hurt Well, walking or just getting off the couch, but still going to the gym, you produce endorphins, you basically you're producing the body's pain reliever. And so when we look at different forms of self harm, like cutting, or burning, these are things that release endorphins. These are things that are pretty, pretty effective at releasing these endorphins. And so when people will say, Well, when I cut I feel better. They I think that's a pretty accurate statement. And I don't think that it's an exaggeration at all. Also, I think that that's when you look at the numbers and you look at just the overall take of of people who have experienced trauma. You find that about two to 6% A lot of individuals will engage in self harm at some point in their lives. Out of that now, this is a pretty substantial number. And it's I think it's a wide gap of a number. But, but still, I mean, depending on the study the research, this is from Matthew toll, he did this research in 2020. He says that students actually have a higher range. And so if the average population is two to 6%, in the US, in the US, his findings were that it was actually 13 to 35% of students. And that's including high school, and college. So we're looking at a pretty high range, I mean, almost somewhere in between the third quarter and a third of students at some point will engage will engage in some form of self harm. Now, what does that how does that tie? I mean, how is it that students tend to have this higher proportion or this higher rate of self harm? I think it's because there's a lot of transition. Transition is very difficult. And we always try to offset transition with control. I also think that trauma plays a huge role in this, what you'll find is that anytime you have trauma in your background, and let's say it's really significant trauma, when you go through transitions in the future and down the road, it brings up those neural pathways that had learned to cope with extreme traumas. And so you will feel such an exaggerated or disproportionate sense of anger or fear, or tension, when you're moving through transition, that it really just reinforces the trauma that you probably felt like you had dealt with in the past, what we're looking for, and I think this is another another aspect of self harm, we're looking for groundedness, we want to feel like we're okay, we want to feel like we're not just all over the place. And as counterintuitive as it seems, a lot of us will do this. And like I said, this is a wide range, it's overworking, maybe it's binging or dieting too much. But it's a very, very common thing. And so when we look at these things, we kind of have a basic idea of what it is that we accomplish when we cut when we do self harm in different forms. The age range, of course, two to 6%, overall in the US 13 to 35% among students. So that's a pretty, pretty significant number. Now, what causes the the tendency, I mean, okay, traumas in the background, we get that unprocessed grief, unprocessed anxiety, these also come into play. But when you look at severe anxiety disorders, severe depression, these are the two highest categories of people who will engage in self harm, and, and some form of self mutilation. This is really, really significant, because when you look worldwide, the numbers just keep going up. I think the last numbers I saw, I think, like 36 37% of the world's population has a pretty well, they're not pretty, they have a clinically significant level of anxiety, which means that they're probably diagnoseable with an anxiety disorder. So on a worldwide level, you're looking at similar numbers, so 30 ish percent, comparative to FIFA, 13 to 36% of individuals that self harm is students. So the numbers are pretty proportionally geared. And it really points to a bigger question is, there are people that report self harm, and then there are people that don't report self harm. And sometimes we just don't know that it's self harm. And so, Amelia wouldn't when you share your question, this is why I think it's such an amazing and brave question to ask. Because it is a terrifying feeling to put yourself out there to be this transparent and honest and and in the middle of something that so many don't understand. And so I'm really I'm really thankful that you're willing to do that. Now. If we're looking at what happens, what's the process that goes into beginning self harm, what are the initial Eating factors. Isolation, I think is a big one. When we feel anxious and depressed, when you look at pretty much every mood disorder, I would imagine probably every personality disorder in the book, I would say that isolation becomes a big factor. In psychotic disorders. For example, let's say schizophrenia, paranoid or delusional, there's, there's a separation. And so an individual might be around people, but they're isolated in their thinking. With depression, we tend to just shut down, we stay in one room, we stay in bed some times, and we avoid social contact. And it's the same with anxiety as well, I think there's a high level of avoidance, sometimes maybe there's a bit of an explosive tendency, we just, we get angry, and we push people away. And so isolation is really the foundation of a means towards cutting a means towards self harm, we see ourselves as less than this is something that in private practice that I really emphasize. When we go through trauma, we have trouble separating shame from guilt. Okay, so if I run a stop sign, and I have to go to court, and the judge says, well, Jason, you're guilty, you did it, you ran, you ran the red light. And I say, Well, yes, I did run the red light. And he says, Well, your guilty case, case finished. But if I leave the courtroom, and I say, I ran a red light, I am a terrible person will see that shame. Guilt is the verdict. Did I do it? Yes, no. But what am I? Who am I? And this leads back to those existential questions. What we do is when we isolate, it really provides a framework for us to be introspective. It provides the framework for us to overthink to over analyze, and if it's not balanced, we will go further and further into those cycles of shame. And so looking at a healthy balance, I think is an important thing. Because again, every level of what we're talking about requires a form of balance. Now, I want to talk about two different perspectives here. I think that there are two theoretical approaches to therapy that really are helpful. There's the humanistic perspective, and the existential perspective, and don't the existentialist perspective, it sounds a lot like Frederick Nietzsche. And we know that Nietzsche was pretty depressed at different points in his life. So let me just be clear that we're not quite going down that route. I do think that there's some fundamental questions that, that existential theory poses. And this is why I think it's an effective form of treatment. Because it talks about the four basic concerns of everybody on the planet, loneliness, isolation, despair, and death. And I think that's pretty safe to say that we all fear those things. On some level, we all are concerned, sometimes we push ourselves to loneliness. And if we push ourselves to loneliness, nine out of 10 times, it's out of a sense of shame. Whether it's a process shame, or an unprocessed one, basically, a realized or unrealized one. But all of these things play together. Now, if you look at the flip side, when we're looking at the, the positive and of growth, what we want to look at would be the the opposite of these things. What we would look at would be creativity and love, authenticity, authenticity, and a sense of free will, I mean, the ability to say, You know what, I really want to do this thing, I can actually be expectant and have a bit of happiness towards it. And it's more the path of how do we get there. Okay. Again, you you guys know me by now, I'm not the positive thinking guru type that's just going to tell you to think differently, suck it up and go back out there and just slap a happy smile on your face and fake it. I don't think that works. And I think honestly, it's just, it's just a load of crap. So if you struggle with these things, you know what I'm talking about, and you know how frustrating it is. So, this is why I really hold a pretty strong opinion about it. But addressing these ultimate concerns, sitting with a therapist who's trained in an existential approach Well, they kind of see themselves in the same boat as anybody else that, as a therapist, they will also see that they struggle with isolation, that despair or fear of loneliness, that that fear of death at the end. And there's less of that cold clinical field. This is what I find to be one of the most effective forms of treatment for really most things. I do think that there are some things I mean, when you're talking about changing a habit or changing, maybe a form of discipline. Well, you can play more into Korea into cognition. But when you're looking at core existential features, I think you have to go to those core existential fears, and in turn, go into those core existential hopes or cravings. Now, it is more philosophical, because it really does make you think you have to really look at what is authenticity? What does it mean to act in authenticity? And that's a tough question. And so having, having someone that will sit alongside of you and be able to do that, in an honest and open way, I think is just an absolute necessity. Now, on the other side, we have the humanistic theory. And this is more Carl Rogers, existentialism is more built around Irvin Yalom, he has some great books out there. The gift of the gift of therapy and existential psychotherapy are excellent. If you have a lot of time and you just want to read about theory, go for it. But when you look at Carl Rogers, Carl Rogers was really keying in on the fact that people are pretty inherently good at their core. And he wasn't talking again about this. What do you call it? Neil revisited, positive or toxic positive thinking. What he's talking about is that at a core, on a core level, we all want to engage, we all want to be a part of something bigger. And so we want to have meaningful relationships, we want to be healthy, we want to make choices for that are in the interests of others. And for ourselves. These are things that Rogers would say, well, that's already there. But when we struggle with anxiety, or depression or self harm, it's because we have not been in the environment that has experienced a pattern of healthiness. And so that that internalized proclivity to mesh or to be compliant to some degree with our environment, well, it kind of falls off. And we become really entrenched in the thinking in the reactivity of, of the framework that we've been taken through in our trauma. And so therapy from an humanistic perspective, would be allowing you to really act out the rage, and the anger that that trauma has caused you. And the therapist at that point is, is a bit of a sounding board begins to really offer a lot of those those core essentials of genuineness and authenticity that that Roger would look at. And so his his main core categories would be empathy, congruence, which is harmony, and an unconditional positive regard. And in an unconditional positive regard is more referring to the fact that, well, you're kind of the same as me. You're not worse, you're not better, we're just kind of in this in the same place. And we're all working in the same direction. It's just that some of us have experienced good things and bad things. And we are all in the same direction, but we're just not in the same place. And so I think these are both really, really effective approaches. And finding a therapist, finding people who can combine these ideas, I think, is an amazing quality because, you know, existentialism looks at those those core fundamental existential fears, like Dev, isolation and meaninglessness, and that fear of being stuck. Whereas on the other side, humanistic theory is going to look at empathy, it's going to look at Harmony, it's going to look at the idea that as a whole, no matter where you are in the process, that you do have the craving and the desire to be more to be better. It's just that the Envy Iron Man hasn't been there. And it hasn't been supportive of allowing you to learn those patterns. And that's a lot of stuff. It's a lot of stuff to think about. But at the end of the day, we do harm ourselves for a pretty significant reason. And it is to often numb out the pain of what we've been through, it's to really cap that feeling of being out of control. And we begin to engage in that fear of meaninglessness, which I think looks a lot like shame, the idea that you might be acceptable, that your purpose is more than just breathing and surviving. This is a tough, tough concept when you've been through trauma. Overcoming is not going to be thinking positively thinking happy thoughts. I say this so many times, because I hear it, I hear it on multiple levels. I see it in social media, circles, I see it in conversations I, I hear it a lot. But when I see it from the perspective of people who struggle with fear and disappointment, and trauma, it doesn't work because, well, the belief isn't there. And so I will always emphasize this. I'm not against positive thinking. But I'm for proper context. And if you've been through hurt, you know, you know, exactly what I mean. And so looking at this, recognizing that our fear our trauma push us into a place where we feel out of control, we feel like we have no purpose or meaning. And we begin questioning, what's the point? What's the point of being here and, and we just want to express and we want to get it out, we want to rage against it. And I think this is what self harm looks like. Now, I would say that if you're if you're struggling with self harm, no matter what form it is, or to what degree it is, I would say that the first step would be really contemplating it would be saying, well, how severe is this? Is it significant enough? Am I just pushing myself a little too hard at the gym? Am I pushing myself a little too hard at the at the office? Or is it pretty? Substantial? I mean, am I working 5060 hours a week in a job that only requires 40? Am I going home and drinking to make up for the pain and the frustration or the fear of failing that might come with working 50 hours a week? Or is it a trauma that has led you to really scrutinize yourself into to lead you towards a sense of self hate or even numbness towards yourself contemplating those things, evaluating. If you have someone that you trust, maybe a friend, a relative, that's it's helpful, it's helpful to have someone as a sounding board. Isolation really drives the ship on this one. The easier the more accessible people in your life, the people that listen well, even when you're thinking and feeling really extreme feelings, these are the people you want to go to. If it's at a point where you're struggling a lot, I would say the first thing would be to go to therapy to sit with someone who's actually trained to really engage and to process these things with you. Personally, again, I really lean more towards someone who can take that existentialist and humanistic approach. Again, I think it's just really, really effective and helpful. I think you'll find that on the other side of it. It really has, it will have challenged the way that you come into the situation or the way that you've handled things in the past. And so I really, I hope that that answers your question to some degree. I wish there were easier answers for for these struggles, because they are so real and they are deep. But overall, just the fact that you reached out and the fact that you really took that risk, it says a lot about you as a person and it says so much about your desire and ability to grow. And, and that's where I think it's going to be amazing. I think that you're already on your way. I think that you probably need someone that's Maybe a few steps ahead, someone that's relatable and someone that will just let you open up and do without all the judgment and all the the correction and the guilt of toxic positivity. And I really wish you the best. Thank you so much, guys. I hope this was insightful. I was for me, I wouldn't when I look through your questions it it really does challenge me to think about things from different perspectives and different ideas. And, and these are things that I really do resonate with, I take in, you get my heart in this one. And I hope that you guys are getting that same connection with it. Continue to send your questions in the you can send them through Instagram at quiet chaos kW, or you can email you can email at info at quiet chaos kw.com So info at quiet chaos kw.com Or check us out at Instagram at quiet chaos kW. I hope you guys have a wonderful week and I will see you next week. We'll pick up we will have more great questions, and we will take them on. Take care. And I will see you soon. This is Jason signing off.

Intro: 31:27

You've been listening to the chaos podcast. Our passion is to talk about anxiety, depression in disorders and answering tough questions. But having fun doing it coming at you with facts, interviews, hard to discuss topics and a little bit more rebellious than your typical mental health show. We hope you've enjoyed it make sure to like rate and review and we'll be back soon. But in the meantime, hit us up on Instagram a quiet chaos kW. Remember, there is hope even when your brain tells you there isn't. See you next time on the quiet chaos podcast.